Then you wouldn't know

Jan 8, 2013
10:41:30am

BigYfan

there are people who come to BYU (even among the LDS) that have struggles with aspects of the honor code either in the past or or are working on them presently.. I did not even mention how much more scrutiny the athletes get, and how much harder it is for them to be a "regular" student at BYU.

This message has been modified

Originally posted on Jan 8, 2013 at 10:41:30am

Message modified by BigYfan on Jan 8, 2013 at 10:41:30am

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BigYfan

New username: Big12Yfan
Bio page: BigYfan
Joined: Jul 13, 2001
Last login: Sep 10, 2021
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Messages

Author

Time

I wish BYU approached the Honor Code like I approach raising my kids

BigYfan

1/8/13 10:25am

good post

Blueto

1/8/13 10:27am

An honor code violation for turning someone in might be a little much

rad dawg

1/8/13 10:28am

My experience with the honor code was far different

Cosmodiar

1/8/13 10:31am

Most here don't have a clue how it works or how it is applied

Mems

1/8/13 10:35am

were you ever called in to meet with the honor code office?

RisinUp

1/8/13 10:39am

I was a tutor for football players in early 90's - knew about some violations,

farsurfer

1/8/13 1:00pm

I must have missed that when I was at BYU. I don't recall thinking about the

HenderCoug

1/8/13 10:28am

Correcto.

Sheikh Djibouti

1/8/13 10:36am

Then you wouldn't know

BigYfan

1/8/13 10:41am

BYU is really good, but could be better, at forcing people to choose the right.

SaltLakeCoug

1/8/13 1:42pm

<< Deleted >>

CougarEyes

1/9/13 7:39am

I think the best way to make sure someone holds to certain standards is to shun

DapperDan

1/8/13 10:29am

Loving shun? Awesome.

CougarFella

1/8/13 2:02pm

RE: I think the best way to make sure someone holds to certain standards is to

gedderdunn

1/9/13 9:33am

The HC office

DapperDan

1/9/13 9:35am

I think there is a lot of faith promoting rumor regarding the evils...

Cougar Insider

1/8/13 10:34am

This is a silly thing to bring up, yet someone always does. BYU was a church

taekwondave

1/8/13 3:13pm

Solid post

goose

1/8/13 10:36am

POTD

RisinUp

1/8/13 10:38am

sure

Belboz

1/8/13 10:39am

I agree. If the rumors were true about Manti Teo I wish Bronco would have

buhlcougar

1/8/13 10:42am

You say if the rumors are true then you ask why we shun sinners. We don't even

Real G Man

1/8/13 10:55am

In terms of shunning sinners I'm talking about the ones we do know.

buhlcougar

1/8/13 10:58am

That my friend is wild speculation, unless you can back it up. You don't know

Real G Man

1/8/13 1:43pm

Not a fan of exploiting people's personal problems for football

aTmcoug

1/8/13 11:56am

How is that exploiting a person's problem? The other colleges are exploiting

buhlcougar

1/8/13 12:24pm

BYU is not the place to come to correct your problems

aTmcoug

1/8/13 12:40pm

If everyone came to BYU with your thoughts in mind then all would be well but we

Real G Man

1/8/13 10:51am

There is something wrong with the Honor Code: It's more restrictive than

PGVikingDad

1/8/13 1:04pm

Well, it should be more difficult to get in, actually, but not as it pertains to

taekwondave

1/8/13 3:19pm

IN what way is the honor code more restrictive

dratax

1/8/13 4:26pm

I'm not talking about working at the temple, but attending.

PGVikingDad

1/8/13 4:41pm

Assuming your description is correct.

dratax

1/8/13 4:49pm

This would cease to be a problem if they simply separated the dress code from

taekwondave

1/8/13 4:53pm

We are all our brothers keepers? Funny twist on the Cain quote, don't you think?

taekwondave

1/8/13 3:18pm

Here's a concrete suggestion... get rid of it.

FierceArc

1/8/13 9:50pm

Everyone has their own bubble

CougAntWave

1/8/13 10:51am

Im with you

vcCoug

1/8/13 5:08pm

Lot of nazis run that place.

Y4LYFE

1/8/13 12:14pm

My experience with the honor code office

yorksama

1/8/13 12:32pm

Hard core delinquent ^^^^^^^^^^

Born2Fish

1/8/13 12:50pm

Seems to me had you gone in there might have been a different end to this

Real G Man

1/8/13 1:48pm

No, it wouldn't have

yorksama

1/8/13 2:09pm

Seems like your real beef is with campus PD, not the honor code office here

Mems

1/8/13 2:18pm

My beef was with both.

yorksama

1/8/13 2:45pm

Sounds like Arnie Lemmon got you

PrisonMike

1/8/13 3:36pm

Give someone a little authority and... unrighteous dominion

frontrowcougar

1/8/13 4:05pm

My paper airplane experience

klay

1/8/13 6:25pm

I've had a lot of situations like this with campus PD

cougarBee

1/8/13 7:38pm

That is a nightmare of a story....

SaltLakeCoug

1/8/13 10:46pm

Good post

Born2Fish

1/8/13 12:44pm

My son left the BYU football program because of the Tattle Tale culture of BYU

raiderhater

1/8/13 12:45pm

Tell him thanks for leaving.

Ragid1

1/8/13 3:11pm

He left because of the tattle tale, I'm more righteous than you attitude.

raiderhater

1/8/13 4:09pm

Let me ask you this

Ragid1

1/9/13 4:30pm

OK Jerk I sure will, your just as bad as the holier than thou kids!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

raiderhater

1/8/13 4:14pm

LOL- are you really name calling?

bigbluecougar

1/8/13 4:50pm

Oh no, I just am trying to prove a point your going to turn me into CB, see

raiderhater

1/8/13 4:56pm

<< Deleted >>

bigbluecougar

1/8/13 6:07pm

Troll or snitch?

1/8/13 4:19pm

Neither

Ragid1

1/9/13 4:34pm

Snitch then got it.

1/9/13 4:54pm

I see your point

Ragid1

1/10/13 9:08am

there should be no necessary evils in the honor code

1/10/13 9:32am

Wrong

Ragid1

1/10/13 2:03pm

What makes you think it's your job to confess others' sins to their bishop?

taekwondave

1/10/13 2:30pm

Oh, saying he sounds like a teenage girl isn't offensive at all, no. Way to keep

taekwondave

1/10/13 9:44am

BYU is the training ground for the churches future leaders

1/10/13 10:04am

I think you are putting words in people's mouth and I think calling it a snitch

Real G Man

1/10/13 11:38am

You are proving my point...

1/10/13 1:13pm

Again, G-money wins this one.

taekwondave

1/10/13 2:31pm

not trying to be a jerk, but was he playing?

Ft Worth Cougar

1/8/13 3:31pm

CA boy, not cut out for the holiness factor!

raiderhater

1/8/13 4:59pm

so that would be a no. Thats fine, just curious.

Ft Worth Cougar

1/9/13 9:14am

So...has anyone here ever experienced Honor Code "tattling" first-hand?

PGVikingDad

1/8/13 12:58pm

I was tattled on twice - never knew WHO tattled - put on probation both times

dougman82

1/8/13 1:04pm

Happened to me... It's definitely real, not legend.

RisinUp

1/8/13 1:47pm

It does happen and sometimes definitely should happen but I think CB makes a

Real G Man

1/8/13 2:15pm

If you had ever been falsely accused of something serious, I would imagine you

1/8/13 2:45pm

that's fair, but put yourself in the shoes of a girl

Jimmy Rocket

1/8/13 3:02pm

You are guilty until proven innocent... with no way to refute your accuser

1/8/13 3:15pm

You realize the difference between a criminal investigation and a HC...

Accipiter

1/8/13 8:32pm

really? there's a difference?

Jimmy Rocket

1/9/13 8:01am

This is one of the biggest problems with the HCO... You are guilty until proven

RisinUp

1/8/13 3:17pm

lol we posted same thought at almost the same time

1/8/13 3:43pm

The situation where someone comes away from the HC office and views

RisinUp

1/8/13 3:53pm

LOL, so you're telling me that I don't want to be called to the HCO?

baastablue

1/8/13 4:03pm

I think they are neither. Rather, they are incredibly inappropriate in what they

taekwondave

1/8/13 4:14pm

Why would you confess to something you didn't do and why wouldn't you confess

Real G Man

1/8/13 11:07pm

I am saying don't confess in the absence of hard evidence. Think what you

taekwondave

1/9/13 8:09am

Remember, I'm not talking about not confessing to God or your Bishop, I'm

taekwondave

1/9/13 8:11am

Except that you signed a contract to not engage in certain otherwise personal

Accipiter

1/9/13 8:26am

If you are falsely accused it doesn't matter

1/9/13 8:42am

The point, friend, is that they shouldn't make people sign that. Yes, you could

taekwondave

1/9/13 10:28am

So the HC should be more like "guidelines"? That's hilarious.

stoils

1/9/13 12:12pm

No. The HC should include standards of academic integrity. The bedroom, the

taekwondave

1/9/13 1:36pm

I don't understand why you can't get this.

Ft Worth Cougar

1/9/13 1:47pm

It wasn't ridiculous before the 1960's and it isn't any more ridiculous now.

taekwondave

1/9/13 1:51pm

In other words, many people, myself included, went to BYU DESPITE the HC, not

taekwondave

1/9/13 1:53pm

you're hard to reason with.

Ft Worth Cougar

1/9/13 1:57pm

I think you have a hard time listening. Church standards are fine for the church

taekwondave

1/9/13 2:10pm

I believe that Church standards should be enforced by those in authority to

RisinUp

1/9/13 2:17pm

You nailed it. Thank you for being more eloquent than me.

taekwondave

1/9/13 2:23pm

I understand a little better now, BUT

Ft Worth Cougar

1/9/13 2:35pm

I know what they believe they're accomplishing. I think they're wrong is all.

taekwondave

1/9/13 2:38pm

one more question and I'm done with this.

Ft Worth Cougar

1/9/13 2:41pm

I guess it would depend on the commandment.

taekwondave

1/9/13 2:44pm

And even if every single commandment helped make you a better student (and

taekwondave

1/9/13 2:47pm

you know which ones i'm talking about. this is silly. you're a grown man.

Ft Worth Cougar

1/9/13 3:00pm

So I take it you mean sexual morality and drugs? I'll tell you what: If you

taekwondave

1/9/13 3:08pm

It isn't the Church's standard they are enforcing. The HC are BYU's. Isn't that

Accipiter

1/9/13 3:51pm

So why would a student be told to write papers over certain talks

RisinUp

1/9/13 3:56pm

Ah yes. I just LOOOOOVED reading those talks and then telling Ed all about it :)

taekwondave

1/9/13 3:57pm

Take away the HC and you have yewtah

stoils

1/10/13 12:03pm

LOL, that's quite the fantasy

DapperDan

1/10/13 12:06pm

Not even close to being true. Clearly you didn't attend either of those schools.

taekwondave

1/10/13 2:32pm

Clearly your deductive reasoning skills are lacking regarding

stoils

1/10/13 5:11pm

All you needed to say was "state school." Don't even pretend that BYU and Utah

taekwondave

1/10/13 7:36pm

That, friend, is ridiculous.

Accipiter

1/9/13 12:22pm

Now if we're talking dress code, that's another matter entirely. BYU could

taekwondave

1/9/13 1:42pm

I agree with you

1/8/13 4:13pm

The fact that you say the tattling is necessary says a lot about you.

UNLVcougar

1/8/13 10:46pm

yeah, happened to me

Jimmy Rocket

1/8/13 2:23pm

How was ANY of that "necessary?" Silly thing to say.

taekwondave

1/8/13 3:46pm

My sister, her boyfriend and me all in seperate incidents

1/8/13 2:32pm

I was evicted for what my roommate THOUGHT my girlfriend and I were doing

taekwondave

1/8/13 3:45pm

WOW. My feelings? It's an HONOR code, so secondhand reports shouldn't be allowed

PGVikingDad

1/8/13 4:27pm

RE: So...has anyone here ever experienced Honor Code "tattling" first-hand?

PowayCoug

1/8/13 5:57pm

Ex-girlfriend's roommate was smoking pot when her roommates weren't home

Y2010

1/9/13 3:13pm

I would say she had to share.

SaltLakeCoug

1/9/13 7:40pm

The Texas A&M honor code includes a line about intolerance of violators

aTmcoug

1/8/13 1:51pm

lol. BM Johnny football

byutx

1/8/13 2:01pm

I lived with the honor code, really, in a house. ;-)

HardManSports

1/8/13 2:21pm

A second thought - People who tattle

HardManSports

1/8/13 2:22pm

I had a sister attending BYU who, to this day, will tell you the only reason

baastablue

1/8/13 2:31pm

Zenoch

1/8/13 3:09pm

If you know someone is doing something morally wrong *but not illegal*, then

PGVikingDad

1/8/13 4:35pm

Cheating on exams is not illegal

dratax

1/8/13 4:56pm

Why the distinction? Whether legal or illegal, the Honor Code prohibits

baastablue

1/8/13 5:05pm

Stop perverting the meaning and intent of that scripture.

taekwondave

1/8/13 5:53pm

RE: I had a sister attending BYU who, to this day, will tell you the only reason

CougarBoard77

1/9/13 12:00am

You're missing my point.

baastablue

1/9/13 8:03am

No Subject

CougarBoard77

1/10/13 8:39am

you're managing a couple of kids. BYU is wrangling 30,000.

Ft Worth Cougar

1/8/13 3:28pm

From my experience, you can be punished for NOT tattling

Riseandshout81

1/8/13 4:04pm

I think your assessment is not an accurate one. I had a family member

PhilPete

1/8/13 4:06pm

As a parent, I want the HC enforced

stoils

1/8/13 4:28pm

Not wanting those kinds of things to happen, and actually taking steps to peek

taekwondave

1/8/13 4:33pm

The peeking isn't the problem... the problem is that there are too many people

stoils

1/8/13 4:47pm

Oh brother. What a stallion you are.

taekwondave

1/8/13 4:53pm

I attended BYU in undergrad and law school, had only one run in with the HC

LV Mike

1/8/13 5:09pm

Absent the honor code BYU is still special. I believe BYU is a special

taekwondave

1/8/13 5:56pm

Agree, it is an honor and privilege to attend BYU

Hang10

1/8/13 7:31pm

I had roommates and friends who bent/broke the honor code

Fatalplacebo

1/8/13 6:11pm

RE: I had roommates and friends who bent/broke the honor code

Shawarma

1/8/13 9:07pm

^^meant for main thread^^

Shawarma

1/8/13 9:19pm

Not just at BYU.

buster

1/8/13 6:29pm

This is how students are typically treated

stonewallperry

1/8/13 7:33pm

Those who report on others should be warned that they will be investigated

Accipiter

1/8/13 8:28pm

I agree. BYU HC seems more like a witch hunt then loving guidance... at least

FierceArc

1/8/13 9:38pm

So you let your prejudices, however right or wrong, possible deny your kids what

Real G Man

1/8/13 11:14pm

Your last sentence is ironic since the HC does just that... dictates what

FierceArc

1/9/13 5:10pm

What a warped sense of the HC you must have. Thousands upon thousands

Real G Man

1/10/13 8:22am

The system itself is offensive. It is culturally inappropriate to peak into

taekwondave

1/10/13 8:31am

No... throw out the system when it's completely unnecessary.

FierceArc

1/10/13 9:47am

I am glad you know it is completely unnecessary ....maybe you ought to share

Real G Man

1/10/13 12:20pm

My arguments are not new. They already know and of course they're not going to

FierceArc

1/10/13 1:12pm

If this is how it works:

dratax

1/9/13 4:19pm

So Brandon Davies would have gone through what he did had he attended

FierceArc

1/9/13 5:12pm

perhaps not national news, but it may be local news

dratax

1/9/13 5:47pm

It wouldn't have been local news any more than some youth in your ward or stake

FierceArc

1/9/13 6:31pm

it wouldn't get the same play today

dratax

1/9/13 9:49pm

That misses the point though. Didnt have to happen at all.

FierceArc

1/9/13 10:14pm

+1 it's time for a change to how the HC is enforced.

swingcat

1/8/13 10:56pm

The Brandon Davies scenario was a disaster.

SaltLakeCoug

1/8/13 11:20pm

TIC?

Ft Worth Cougar

1/9/13 2:37pm

RE: TIC?

SaltLakeCoug

1/9/13 7:43pm

Agreed, but the other side of the coin is exceptions for athletes.

Ft Worth Cougar

1/9/13 8:56pm

Well freaking said

Italics

1/9/13 1:53am

Did everyone go to the same BYU that I did!?

CougarEyes

1/9/13 7:42am

Duke University Community Standard

Y2010

1/9/13 2:58pm

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