These days there are few discussions on his Mormon Stories podcast that don't veer into controversial, "the church sucks" kind of grounds. It's been a disappointing evolution from what his podcasts originally were, although he has always been drawn to the imperfections in Mormonism.

Dehlin's agenda now is very clear: he wants to be the voice and the healing balm for people who don't believe in Mormonism, want to transition away from it, or otherwise don't feel comfortable in/don't like the church.

It's become quite a business for him.