You have to provide double amnesty, pending a criminal investigation. The

Jul 28, 2016
10:47:01pm

TaiJuan All-American

problem is, and always has been, that consent is like the self defense defense. You have to admit you did the thing, and by admitting you did the thing you get disciplined for breaking the HC while the counterpart does not.

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TaiJuan

Previous username: QuinneyCoug
Bio page: TaiJuan
Joined: Jul 20, 2010
Last login: Dec 29, 2023
Total posts: 31,096 (6,132 FO)

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Messages

Author

Time

My issue with "amnesty" is that at some point there WILL be someone who tries to

LeftOfNormal

7/28/16 10:28pm

The rape defense has been around for ages. No system is going to be perfect

shimmy

7/28/16 10:31pm

Should be, but aren't. Noone wants to even LOOK like they're going after victims

LeftOfNormal

7/28/16 10:34pm

The question is: Is your scenario either more frequent or more damaging than the one where an actual rape victim keeps

Nikomedes

7/28/16 10:37pm

Based on what evidence?

boogers

7/28/16 10:38pm

Also fair, but there's got to be a way where a false accusation can't be used as

LeftOfNormal

7/28/16 10:44pm

You have to provide double amnesty, pending a criminal investigation. The

TaiJuan

7/28/16 10:47pm

But again, at that point, who CARES what the HC will and won't be investigating

LeftOfNormal

7/28/16 10:56pm

Bottom line for me is that if you're a dude, you should assume any physical

TaiJuan

7/28/16 10:41pm

Or...make sure its on video.

boogers

7/28/16 10:41pm

Not the worst idea, honestly.

TaiJuan

7/28/16 10:44pm

That is nice in theory, but not very effective

7/29/16 2:02am

Again, you know the rape defense has been around for ages for the sex right?

shimmy

7/28/16 10:41pm

This changes incentives in a major way. There's no downside to a false report.

TaiJuan

7/28/16 10:52pm

A false rape accusation is not a little fudge. It does change the incentive,

Baron

7/28/16 11:00pm

If you can tell the HCO one thing and the cops another you can have you cake and

TaiJuan

7/28/16 11:30pm

There's just not a good answer. "False accusations should be prosecuted to the

Cougarrrs

7/28/16 10:43pm

Would he get kicked out of UVU? I doubt it

concolor couguar

7/28/16 10:33pm

Maybe he is, maybe not. Maybe he drops out to work to pay for his lawyer.

LeftOfNormal

7/28/16 10:37pm

Wait now she is making false reports to the police not just to the HCO?

concolor couguar

7/28/16 10:40pm

Yes, I assumed that was clear. One doesn't typically go to the HCO to report a

LeftOfNormal

7/28/16 10:52pm

Your scenario was that the HCO came to the student with a complaint from the

concolor couguar

7/28/16 10:57pm

Apologies. I should have clarified. I figured it was assumed that if one levies

LeftOfNormal

7/28/16 11:00pm

Can you honestly offer amnesty to someone who is good enough to tell the HCO it

TaiJuan

7/28/16 11:01pm

Which is why it's ludicrous that the office is even investigating kissing

titlecoug

7/28/16 10:33pm

I agree, but who knows WHAT the well-meaning roommate said. All the girl knows

LeftOfNormal

7/28/16 10:39pm

The HC enforcement is the root of the problem. Amensty will just make women

boogers

7/28/16 10:39pm

I support amnesty in principle, but it's gonna be a clusteryewt for dudes down

TaiJuan

7/28/16 10:43pm

Do you think it will actually increase false reporting?

concolor couguar

7/28/16 10:45pm

Absolutely.

boogers

7/28/16 10:46pm

i don't see how the incentive is significantly increased.

concolor couguar

7/28/16 10:48pm

Yes. You can't say that granting amnesty won't change incentives, and that's

TaiJuan

7/28/16 10:48pm

How much do you think they increase? How much will actual rape reporting

concolor couguar

7/28/16 10:51pm

First, how many rapes are NOT reported.

boogers

7/28/16 10:55pm

I would say more than are falsely reported

concolor couguar

7/28/16 10:58pm

But that's in a system that doesn't provide the same incentives for falsificatn

TaiJuan

7/28/16 11:04pm

There I agree with you. This would be much simpler if the HCO's enforcement were severely curtailed

Nikomedes

7/28/16 10:55pm

Once again, amensty is not the issue in this scenario. It is the honor code

Baron

7/28/16 10:36pm

So the HC now prohibits kissing? How quaint

CougarThug

7/28/16 10:39pm

Again, that's fair, but it's the situation people could be put in, until the HC

LeftOfNormal

7/28/16 10:43pm

It is a situation that always existed. You could always lie to put the blame on

Baron

7/28/16 10:46pm

HC is the problem

dixieutahbyuzag

7/29/16 12:31am

Such a weird thing to worry about. Seriously.

Blueto

7/28/16 10:42pm

A dim view of very few, actually, but that few scare the yewt out of me.

LeftOfNormal

7/28/16 10:58pm

If you'd been through what someone close to me has been through wrt false

NewMexiCoug

7/29/16 5:49am

It already happens now, and may be slightly more likely after, but the benefits still outweigh

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