Yes. And No.

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Nov 20, 2014
4:35:09pm

Gerald-DeGroot

Yes. And No.

It's definitely possible to be both.

But one usually cancels out the other.

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Gerald-DeGroot

Previous username: GoCougarsKris
Bio page: Gerald-DeGroot
Joined: Jun 24, 2004
Last login: Feb 17, 2021
Total posts: 47,510 (2,199 FO)

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Messages

Author

Time

Here is why BYU doesn't compete with the top national programs very often...

bluefish

11/20/14 4:18pm

Yeah, none of that went on in the 1980's

Sea Chicken

11/20/14 4:22pm

And we have many of the same results then, too

Justinodhan

11/20/14 4:26pm

BYU/LaVell tolerated plenty in the 80's

acougfan

11/20/14 5:32pm

Jim McMahon's Book will tell you all you need to know

Ymer Dunker

11/20/14 10:08pm

He didn't tolerate it...

BaYoU

11/21/14 12:53pm

you are wrong

acougfan

11/21/14 4:49pm

I'm not saying players didn't misbehave...

BaYoU

11/22/14 1:00am

So you're like many of BYU fans who aren't so much fanatics about football but

Gerald-DeGroot

11/20/14 4:25pm

Can you be both?

TrueAndBlue

11/20/14 4:32pm

Yes. And No.

Gerald-DeGroot

11/20/14 4:35pm

I think that's true in many cases. But I also think there are a ton of die hard

TrueAndBlue

11/20/14 4:38pm

I do as well. I think.

Gerald-DeGroot

11/20/14 4:41pm

Agreed. It shouldn't be an excuse. We are all expected to be excellent at our

TrueAndBlue

11/20/14 4:48pm

Um, here's a radical concept: The Church owns BYU, so they get to set the rules

BeardedSpock

11/20/14 4:33pm

They could also put millions more $$ into the program

kotacoug

11/20/14 4:35pm

I think the Church wants the program to be self-sufficient more than Top 25

BeardedSpock

11/20/14 4:41pm

What's funny with that logic is fans

DaveLB

11/20/14 4:57pm

ESPN is not unhappy with the BYU contract

BaYoU

11/21/14 11:13am

More evidence ESPN is happy with BYU is all the scheduling arrangements thay are

Lance71

11/21/14 11:34am

Yep

BaYoU

11/21/14 12:36pm

They do value the program as a missionary tool but

P-Town2P-Town

11/20/14 5:27pm

With that line if thinking in wonder how the widow feels about the 2 billion$

kotacoug

11/20/14 6:33pm

I don't know, but my guess is

P-Town2P-Town

11/20/14 8:35pm

Great let's do the same for football

kotacoug

11/20/14 9:47pm

Touché

P-Town2P-Town

11/20/14 10:11pm

Couldn't agree more

TrueAndBlue

11/20/14 10:22pm

We are, aren't we?

BaYoU

11/21/14 12:58pm

They have

BaYoU

11/21/14 12:42pm

Thats not where I was going with my post. At all.

Gerald-DeGroot

11/20/14 4:36pm

Hard to tell with your subtle snipe about fans of a "Church owned university"

BeardedSpock

11/20/14 4:39pm

I don't want the church to really do much differently.

Gerald-DeGroot

11/20/14 4:47pm

First off, is BYU is "mediocre" there are about 70-80 Division I schools that

BeardedSpock

11/20/14 4:55pm

I can't debate with people that don't see how mediocre

Gerald-DeGroot

11/20/14 5:25pm

Pretty lofty expectations considering his record against decent teams.

DaveLB

11/20/14 5:39pm

What a strange comment. You would rather see BYU cheat, abandon it's principles,

Lance71

11/20/14 4:35pm

Yep. That's exactly what I said. Word for word.

Gerald-DeGroot

11/20/14 5:27pm

I didn't get that extreme from the post...

icecougar

11/20/14 8:12pm

more like they're fans of Bronco first and then fans of BYU football

icecougar

11/20/14 7:46pm

Maybe this explains SOME of the difference. Stanford plays by the rules.

Still Questing

11/20/14 4:26pm

I'm sure Stanford tolerates drug and alcohol abuse. And partying

TrueAndBlue

11/20/14 4:33pm

Ah, my bad, I missed #5. That automatically kicks out every FBS team but BYU.

Still Questing

11/20/14 4:34pm

Yeah but I also think it's a cop out. The other ones are a disadvantage for sure

TrueAndBlue

11/20/14 4:36pm

Yeah, just stating the obvious - #5 was only needed to make the game pointless.

Still Questing

11/20/14 4:38pm

Look, BYU comes close enough at times to reasonably think that they can

boogers

11/20/14 4:31pm

Bronco is pushing the program into a service academy mode that we

kotacoug

11/20/14 4:33pm

I just don't see that at all. He's odd, but not that odd.

boogers

11/20/14 4:35pm

Wrong. Its not Bronco, its the administration, from the top down...

bluefish

11/20/14 5:59pm

Bronco has taken it to a whole new level

kotacoug

11/20/14 6:34pm

Name a coach we could hire that would get us into a power conference?

bluefish

11/20/14 5:51pm

We could be A LOT better than we are with some changes in the culture

kotacoug

11/20/14 4:31pm

See, I don't know if its a culture issue or just a talent issue.

boogers

11/20/14 4:34pm

They go hand in hand. The culture ends up dictating the talent

kotacoug

11/20/14 4:47pm

I don't know. BYU has never had deep talent. They've had the stars align

boogers

11/20/14 4:50pm

I recently ran into a former player and we talked at length about this.

TrueAndBlue

11/20/14 4:35pm

Curious, what did the player think should change? Was he a starter?

boogers

11/20/14 4:38pm

Just got in my car, will post later

kotacoug

11/20/14 4:39pm

My list of things the top programs do are all part of a program "culture"...

bluefish

11/20/14 5:54pm

Offenses have changed to be more like BYU's was in the 80's and defenses

ByuMba90

11/20/14 4:35pm

Agreed. This is why we lose to Utah regularly. Whittingham figured us out...

bluefish

11/20/14 5:55pm

utah? BSU?

nashty

11/20/14 4:40pm

Not buying it.

bluefish

11/20/14 6:01pm

It doesn't help that our coaches tend to suck.

Real Men Wear Blue

11/20/14 5:01pm

Look, we're out to prove that we CAN get it done with BYU's standards.

CalGTR

11/20/14 5:35pm

Agreed. I didn't say I hope we fail. But after 20 years, I'm a realist...

bluefish

11/20/14 5:57pm

So were we doing something from points 1-6 at the beginning of this year? We

Jam Master J

11/20/14 7:08pm

if we cultivated mined Polynesia and Africa through the church

Y05

11/20/14 7:47pm

Like Monson said

crookedUTE

11/20/14 9:06pm

I haven't looked into whether or not they've finished top 5, but Mark Richt at

FierceArc

11/20/14 11:11pm

Hogwash (I can say hogwash now that I'm in my 40's)

marklar39

11/20/14 11:50pm

I just don't believe cheating gives people an advantage

deljdc

11/21/14 7:57am

do you want to quantify how long long term is?

Y05

11/21/14 8:09am

Tennesee was on top and took a dive. Texas was on top and took a dive. USC was

deljdc

11/21/14 4:56pm

but what about the long term collusion the P5 has going with no end in sigh

Y05

11/22/14 1:13am

I agree that this poses a big danger to BYU, but I don't view that

deljdc

11/22/14 6:37am

I agree. But look at who's winning national championships in football...

bluefish

11/21/14 11:11am

That's the part of the country that has the players.

deljdc

11/21/14 4:53pm

But you wouldn't know if it did, right? i mean we hear about

SaltLakeCoug

11/21/14 7:35pm

Translation: Let's not worry about being mediocre because unless you cheat, you

BYUisLife

11/21/14 8:23am

Agreed...

crookedUTE

11/21/14 4:51pm

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