It's actually pretty funny that you think Unions are low cost and efficient

Jul 24, 2017
8:40:45am

Skeptical Optimist All-American

As a management consultant, some of the biggest head-scratching inefficiencies I've seen are a direct result of union requirements, and the millionaire union bosses smile at the idea of it being low cost.

Report problem with this ad

Skeptical Optimist

Previous username: workindev
Bio page: Skeptical Optimist
Joined: Aug 2, 2006
Last login: Apr 26, 2024
Total posts: 79,027 (4,236 FO)

Report problem with this ad

Messages

Author

Time

My company (in Provo), pulled a complete garbage move on vacation.

Division Bell

7/24/17 7:32am

That's the trend in vacation policy

wapiti

7/24/17 7:34am

I know. It still sucks, and it's still manipulative.

Division Bell

7/24/17 7:36am

That's the free market. If you don't like it go work elsewhere

CDV

7/24/17 7:36am

Resume is all ready being distributed. By that logic, if you don't like Trump,

Division Bell

7/24/17 7:38am

RE: Resume is all ready being distributed. By that logic, if you don't like Trump,

macaroni

7/24/17 9:13am

That's not even close to the same thing.

byuTX

7/24/17 9:37am

It isn't that simple or easy.

BYUtka

7/24/17 8:59am

I could not agree more with you

pastyute

7/24/17 7:37am

Tired of your job? Ever consider making more money while making a few calls

Cougarpolis

7/24/17 7:38am

It wipes a major liability off the balance sheet for them. I understand that

Skeptical Optimist

7/24/17 7:39am

And puts it on the employees.

Division Bell

7/24/17 7:41am

Yes, but it's not really all that different. You needed to clear any time off in

Skeptical Optimist

7/24/17 7:46am

It is very different if/when you leave the company

cheezedawg

7/24/17 7:48am

No, it's nothing similar. I had banked 160 hours as part of an exit strategy

Division Bell

7/24/17 7:50am

Good point. They should compensate you for that banked time. They shouldn't be

Skeptical Optimist

7/24/17 7:52am

Don't they have to compensate you for the benefit that accrued under the

cracka

7/24/17 7:53am

Not according to the instructions/memo given last week.

Division Bell

7/24/17 7:54am

I would ask

rggee

7/24/17 7:58am

I did. It's just gone (as if they could just take it away w/ no consequences).

Division Bell

7/24/17 8:02am

As others have mentioned, that would be illegal for them to do in CA

cheezedawg

7/24/17 8:14am

Very justified rant, in that case.

Skeptical Optimist

7/24/17 8:14am

You may want to seek some legal advice about that. It's certainly not my area

cracka

7/24/17 8:02am

When my company moved to the unlimited policy, they paid out the PTO in cash

inertiaman

7/24/17 7:56am

I call BS. I don't think they can get away with not paying you out

shakarocks

7/24/17 8:01am

In Utah, they totally can.

BYUtka

7/24/17 8:07am

Are you sure? Keep in mind this isn't a termination or a quitting employee

shakarocks

7/24/17 8:12am

OK... it is a bit vague in Utah... it certainly isn't clear cut, and Utah tends

BYUtka

7/24/17 8:15am

Are you a fitness instructor now turned employment lawyer?

BlueFrog

7/24/17 1:43pm

Lose Vacation to non usage?? Especially given the underlying theme of how you fe

Osteotome

7/24/17 8:19am

I don't think 4 to 6 weeks is standard. Try to 2 to 3 weeks and if you been there a long time maybe more.

Baron

7/24/17 7:41am

Ok. Standard for every job I have had.

Skeptical Optimist

7/24/17 7:43am

Our company gives you a 4th week after 10 years.

BluebloodOR

7/24/17 4:39pm

The top of all MLM's get paid heavily

BlueFrog

7/24/17 7:40am

But they can smile and dance on stage!

Division Bell

7/24/17 7:42am

I would immediately go into my boss and let him know that I

Ty10s_WinGames

7/24/17 7:44am

Sounds like InsideSales.com except for your last paragraph

maxpowers

7/24/17 7:44am

NuSkin

inertiaman

7/24/17 7:58am

You might look into the legality of that move. In California accrued vacation

mbs6

7/24/17 7:49am

NY is the same I believe.

Radioactive Coug

7/24/17 7:54am

Utah is not. Utah is ruthless toward employees.

BYUtka

7/24/17 7:57am

Well, there is this...

Radioactive Coug

7/24/17 8:06am

Also...

Radioactive Coug

7/24/17 8:07am

Based on those two things, while not being a lawyer, I would say that unless

Radioactive Coug

7/24/17 8:09am

Well played.

mbs6

7/24/17 8:27am

There is a basic concept that applies here: If you promise an employee something

DirtyWater

7/24/17 1:58pm

Two Choices: Get a new job or move from Utah. Better than government getting

CObluezone

7/24/17 9:31am

If only there were some mechanism for employees to all get together and tell the

joelvandyne

7/24/17 8:20am

There is. If enough people quit his employer, they'll change it back.

Skeptical Optimist

7/24/17 8:26am

Must be a tough job market for this type of job in Utah, then

Yoshinobu

7/24/17 8:31am

Seems like there ought to be a lower cost solution that doesn't require all

joelvandyne

7/24/17 8:34am

It's actually pretty funny that you think Unions are low cost and efficient

Skeptical Optimist

7/24/17 8:40am

Who said they need to go out and join a big national union with fat cat execs?

joelvandyne

7/24/17 8:45am

Those fat cat execs are part of the package. And to answer your other question,

Skeptical Optimist

7/24/17 10:05am

That's a great idea! Then they could band together and demand such riches that

Pimpin4Paradise

7/24/17 8:27am

Or they could make reasonable requests and not be political caricatures, yet

joelvandyne

7/24/17 8:32am

Sounds like you don't understand how unions function in reality.

Pimpin4Paradise

7/24/17 8:34am

RE: Sounds like you don't understand how unions function in reality.

joelvandyne

7/24/17 8:36am

Many industries aren't unionized. The ones that are have companies that find it

Pimpin4Paradise

7/24/17 8:52am

If a company can't remain viable without abusing their workforce you'll have a

joelvandyne

7/24/17 8:57am

Employees don't need to unionize in order to demand fair treatment. The free

Pimpin4Paradise

7/24/17 9:03am

Based on the OP it appears to be moving the opposite direction.

joelvandyne

7/24/17 9:14am

One random dude's opinion on an anonymous message board does not a case study

Pimpin4Paradise

7/24/17 9:18am

It's still one more than you've presented.

joelvandyne

7/24/17 9:21am

Switch careers? Nobody is advocating switching your career.

Conan

7/24/17 10:04am

For better or worse, governmental worker protections have been

TaiJuan

7/24/17 9:06am

Though when you look at California municipal pension woes it's hard to argue

TaiJuan

7/24/17 8:58am

This is exactly my point.

Pimpin4Paradise

7/24/17 8:59am

I'm not talking about going out and joining a big national union.

joelvandyne

7/24/17 9:03am

No, there isn't. I think that collective bargaining is bad for business and

Pimpin4Paradise

7/24/17 9:07am

I agree that everyone who is dissatisfied should express these concerns up the

TaiJuan

7/24/17 9:11am

This is the point i'm driving at. I don't think collective action or bargaining

joelvandyne

7/24/17 9:18am

This is already happening. That is the market at work. But it's not flashy, no

TaiJuan

7/24/17 9:23am

You are driving at nothing, then. Your rhetorical question seeking a "mechanism"

cheezedawg

7/24/17 9:29am

Sorry you can't think of a way to organize without a national behemoth behind

joelvandyne

7/24/17 9:36am

You really like to personalize your arguments. It's very manipulative. I once

TaiJuan

7/24/17 9:39am

FYI- the only person that has said "national behemoth" is you

cheezedawg

7/24/17 12:14pm

At my company where it's a seller's market for talent, the employees frequently

TaiJuan

7/24/17 8:48am

Gold. Well done.

macaroni

7/24/17 9:13am

And then charge themselves to be a part of said banded together employees

BluebloodOR

7/24/17 4:42pm

We just got 3 more days added

jxncoog

7/24/17 8:27am

At least they won't have to pay you accrued pto when they lay you off.

Dillinger

7/24/17 8:36am

When I was at GT it's one of the reasons I left.

RedlandsCoug

7/24/17 8:54am

Y2010

7/24/17 8:56am

My company basically does this. People get waaaaay more vacation time than they

RalphWiggam

7/24/17 10:17am

"Hey Boss, I'm taking 4 weeks off starting tomorrow."

IGlowInTheDark

7/24/17 11:15am

Honeywell just started implementing this policy

ArchbishopMitty

7/24/17 1:28pm

Seriously though, they just don't want to have to pay accrued PTO when somebody quits or gets laid off.

Posting on CougarBoard