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May 21, 2019
9:41
:46
pm
chilango
All-American
I think this is accurate, in my experience.
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chilango
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chilango
Joined
Jul 23, 2009
Last login
Dec 27, 2020
Total posts
25,771 (33 FO)
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Messages
Author
Time
Germany vs Japan post WWII symbolism?
Xenon
5/21/19 8:41pm
Because the Japanese are "foreign"
kccougar
5/21/19 8:54pm
Plus, the German atrocities were actually more spectacular, and evil.
chilango
5/21/19 9:22pm
The rape of Nanking is about as horrifying of treatment towards other humans as
che flaco
5/21/19 9:33pm
It was horrible, but Auschwitz was worse. As were Treblinka and the other
chilango
5/21/19 9:36pm
Japanese atrocities were more personal. German were more industrial.
TriggerWarning
5/21/19 10:16pm
Sure but it is also more similar to the kinds of warfare tyrants and conquerors have engaged in for millennia
YIsForBrigham
5/22/19 9:33am
My opinion: because Germany is a European country and is part of the western
che flaco
5/21/19 8:54pm
There is something uniquely horrifying about Nazism
spinner
5/21/19 8:58pm
Agree with that, it is definitely uniquely horrifying and that is definitely
che flaco
5/21/19 9:02pm
Sure, but the gulags are also not unique
spinner
5/21/19 9:07pm
Fair enough
che flaco
5/21/19 9:10pm
As much as they were 'work' camps they were more grind em into dust
coug almighty
5/21/19 9:28pm
Plus the Nazis had more uniquely identifying symbols and institutions, whereas
Mike Honcho
5/21/19 9:34pm
Because as bad as the Japanese were, the Germans were worse. Probably the most
chilango
5/21/19 9:20pm
Wow, you need to listen to Dan Carlin's Hardcore History Podcast
Frank Drebin
5/21/19 9:27pm
No estimate of slaughter of civilians that I’ve ever seen puts Japan in the same
chilango
5/21/19 9:32pm
You are severely underestimating the sheer brutality of the Japanese in WW2.
TriggerWarning
5/21/19 9:37pm
No, I’m not. But many here severely underestimate the brutality of Germany under
chilango
5/21/19 9:39pm
The Japanese killed more people than the Nazis, in more personal and grousome
TriggerWarning
5/21/19 9:42pm
I think this article also provides a reason why we hear more about Hitler than
Mike Honcho
5/21/19 9:45pm
Interesting stat: 4% of US POWs in German custody died. 27% under Japanese
TriggerWarning
5/21/19 9:49pm
They definitely treated POWs worse than the Germans did. There’s no debate
chilango
5/21/19 9:52pm
The Japanese treated Western Allies’ POWs much worse than the Germans did
spinner
5/21/19 9:57pm
True, there was a big difference between Soviet POWs and Western ones. But even
chilango
5/21/19 10:03pm
Pretty much
spinner
5/21/19 10:07pm
An interesting tidbit, side note. The largest massacre of POW's on American soil
So it goes...
5/21/19 10:24pm
What an interesting, sad bit of history. I'd never heard of this incident.
spinner
5/22/19 6:42am
That's terrible.
HighHorse
5/22/19 9:21am
Look at the chart in this article, for perspective. The column titled “Civilian
chilango
5/21/19 9:49pm
Stop. They were both depraved and evil in their special ways. The Germans
TriggerWarning
5/21/19 9:53pm
Your own chart has 15-20 million Chinese dead compared to 6 million Poles.
TriggerWarning
5/21/19 10:00pm
You’re reading the wrong column. It’s 7.3-8.2 million Chinese civilians who were
chilango
5/21/19 10:06pm
So you’re not counting the 10M Chinese who were starved to death by the
TriggerWarning
5/21/19 10:09pm
Correct, also not counting the 10M Russians starved to death by the Germans, to
chilango
5/21/19 10:16pm
I get your point. I think you are more shocked by the depraved and calculated
TriggerWarning
5/21/19 10:21pm
Nope, what the Japanese did was every bit as premeditated, evil and large in
Frank Drebin
5/21/19 9:38pm
No, it wasn’t. Among other things, the Germans committed genocide on a planned,
chilango
5/21/19 9:40pm
Chilango, are you Japanese?
Mike Honcho
5/21/19 9:42pm
No. It just happens to be a topic on which I’m well informed. I lived in China,
chilango
5/21/19 9:52pm
You actually don’t seem that well informed.
TriggerWarning
5/21/19 9:56pm
Maybe that’s because you aren’t? Kind of like when evangelicals tell me I’m
chilango
5/21/19 9:59pm
Really strange analogy dude. Kinda weird.
TriggerWarning
5/21/19 10:01pm
You’re assuming others aren’t as well informed, which is probably not true
Mike Honcho
5/21/19 10:03pm
Being informed is besides the point, it’s weird to be so adamant that one
che flaco
5/21/19 10:16pm
Wow dude. Those are some troubling blinders.
TriggerWarning
5/21/19 9:43pm
I agree, lots of troubling blinders on this board.
chilango
5/21/19 9:55pm
<< Deleted >>
lightmann
5/21/19 10:55pm
The German people are a lot more repentant and regretful of their atrocities in
TriggerWarning
5/21/19 9:36pm
IIRC, Japanese war criminals weren’t even considered criminals in Japan after
Mike Honcho
5/21/19 9:41pm
I think this is accurate, in my experience.
chilango
5/21/19 9:41pm
Curious about that experience. How broad is it? My interactions with the
777
5/21/19 11:29pm
Not to American POWs. 17% died in German camps, almost 50% died in Japanese
CougarAndMerlin
5/21/19 11:48pm
Agree. OTOH, the Germans were genocidal, while the Japanese were not.
chilango
5/22/19 12:07am
<< Deleted >>
Dynasty1
5/22/19 7:03am
Reputationally, not in the war itself. And I said nothing about the Allies.
chilango
5/22/19 7:05am
They're the villains of every Hollywood movie. I think that 1933-1945 greatly
Dynasty1
5/22/19 7:29am
Which is why many people tend to go easier on them than they deserve. That and
chilango
5/22/19 7:42am
What about the Americans who fire bombed all those cities? Even Mcnamara
777
5/21/19 11:22pm
Interesting that way more Japanese were killed by fire bombing than nukes, but
CougarAndMerlin
5/21/19 11:45pm
Anyone that thinks the Japanese weren’t at least terrible as the Germans aren’t informed. I personally think the Japanes
sgriff
5/22/19 12:29am
The same reason the Nazis are considered *slightly* less evil than Mao,
valleus
5/22/19 4:18am
That's true
HighHorse
5/22/19 4:39am
Slightly less, or slightly more?
chilango
5/22/19 5:58am
Dude, just stop talking. You're apparently horribly misinformed on this issue
UberDeek
5/22/19 9:13am
The irony is so thick. But in this case, his post describes why more, not why
chilango
5/22/19 9:21am
Wow, you're so stuck on the genocide... You've discounted how many human lives
UberDeek
5/22/19 9:32am
Yeah, it’s so weird to get stuck on genocide, especially the industrial-scale
chilango
5/22/19 10:17am
Yeah, and a German Nazi helped saved 200,000 chinese from the Japanese during the rape of Nanking.
sgriff
5/22/19 10:37am
Yes, I’ve been there, several times. My company had offices in Nanjing, so I
chilango
5/22/19 10:49am
I see what you're saying. Fair enough.
sgriff
5/22/19 11:33am
Do you think that maybe your experience there has possibly clouded your
macaroni
5/22/19 12:22pm
It’s definitely informed it. More data and information are usually helpful and
chilango
5/22/19 2:40pm
Of course it’s generally good. It can also cloud your analysis negatively.
macaroni
5/22/19 3:03pm
The POW discussion is clear, the Japanese were much worse than the Germans, at
chilango
5/22/19 4:13pm
I really don't see the uniqueness....
Xenon
5/22/19 5:25pm
You’re not Chinese though. You clearly have an affinity for Asian culture. To
macaroni
5/22/19 6:58pm
And Minnie Vautrin and Gingling Women's College (a Christian College at the
Troy McClure
5/22/19 4:46pm
At one level, comparing atrocities is a farce, and
valleus
5/22/19 4:03pm
They actually weren't though. The targeting of ethnic groups goes back a long
Dynasty1
5/22/19 4:08pm
I disagree ... the only unique element of Nazi Evil was EFFICIENCY...
Xenon
5/22/19 5:12pm
I agree with both of you, ethnic killing is old as recorded history. But the
valleus
5/22/19 6:26pm
I don’t see why that matters. Really, why does that matter? Wouldn’t you be more
macaroni
5/22/19 6:50pm
You can argue if the difference matters in a moral sense or not. Robert Conquest
valleus
5/22/19 7:08pm
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