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Dec 7, 2019
12:49
:40
pm
jkccoug
All-American
The data shows better outcomes on average for low risk pregnancies OUTSIDE
The hospital setting. That’s what the data says.
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jkccoug
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Socrates Johnson
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jkccoug
Joined
Jul 19, 2002
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Oct 13, 2021
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Messages
Author
Time
My stepdaughter is newly pregnant, and she and her boyfriend are leaning heavily
Loon to the Moon
12/7/19 11:38am
<< Deleted >>
Kauai
12/7/19 11:38am
Somehow I hit post too soon. Fixed it. 🙂
Loon to the Moon
12/7/19 11:42am
Yeah I wasn't sure where this was headed 🙂
Kauai
12/7/19 11:43am
we had a scare on one of ours. not sure a birthing center would have given us similar positive outcome. Too risky IMO
BlueFrog
12/7/19 11:44am
If she doesn't have risk factors, it's totally fine. Great option.
Phasor
12/7/19 11:42am
If it’s her first I’d go with an obstetrician, but that’s me
pegushin
12/7/19 11:42am
Two of my kids did that. It was fine.
SandYFan
12/7/19 11:42am
Wow. Either you’re joking or I was way, way off on your age
cougarnerd
12/7/19 1:18pm
If she is young and healthy seems like a fine idea. What is the concern?
BYUtka
12/7/19 11:46am
My wife is concerned about complications that could arise, and my stepdaughter
Loon to the Moon
12/7/19 11:49am
Your wife’s concern is valid, but in the end it’s not her choice.
spugeddy24
12/7/19 12:31pm
👍🏻 Yes, we agree it is completely their choice and will support what they
Loon to the Moon
12/7/19 2:48pm
A girl in my parents’ ward used one. There were complications that the midwife
flavordave
12/7/19 11:46am
This is why I always suggest hospital
trom2foot3
12/7/19 11:51am
Agree. My wife had a midwife for our third, but at the hospital to be safe.
Narfin'Coug
12/7/19 12:07pm
This is why I don’t understand the whole midwife thing. People
kotacoug
12/7/19 12:29pm
I consider those that want to deliver this way about on par with anti vaxer’s...
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 12:41pm
My sister almost died in childbirth because of an infection she got from
Iman23
12/7/19 1:01pm
The hospital isn’t the only place you can get an infection so those odds are
kotacoug
12/7/19 1:17pm
We started out with a midwife clinic. It was a disaster. I wanted to go with an
trom2foot3
12/7/19 11:50am
I appreciate all these responses. Keep them coming!
Loon to the Moon
12/7/19 11:56am
No experience with it, but seems like a terrible idea tbh
Odysseus
12/7/19 11:57am
^^^ one of those weirdos who prefers his computer over a typewriter.
Zach Morris
12/7/19 12:19pm
Isn’t using a midwife similar to a farmer preferring a horse and plow over a tractor?
Zach Morris
12/7/19 11:57am
We did it once and my mom did that, plus had two at home too
jkccoug
12/7/19 11:57am
I must point out that not all midwives are created equal. We had one once that
jkccoug
12/7/19 12:00pm
I don't get the "they are next to a hospital" argument in favor of midwifes. I
vegasnative
12/7/19 2:54pm
Deleted. Tried to give a response to the OP
demon_llama
12/7/19 11:59am
your wife knew more after 4 babies
WorfoSAUR
12/7/19 12:04pm
Big difference between watching labor and laboring.
jkccoug
12/7/19 12:07pm
No chance that’s true...
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 12:29pm
<< Deleted >>
demon_llama
12/7/19 12:50pm
Riiiggffhhhttt.... she knew more than professionals who deliver
kotacoug
12/7/19 12:31pm
It's fine. There are risks, but also risks in hospitals IMO
runnincoug
12/7/19 12:00pm
Would she consider a midwife at a hospital?
durandal
12/7/19 12:02pm
We did our first two and our fourth with midwives at a hospital but
jkccoug
12/7/19 12:04pm
Yeah, that isn't too surprising. That's sort of the appeal of birthing centers, right? They're just more comfortable and
durandal
12/7/19 12:27pm
This.
spugeddy24
12/7/19 12:33pm
Honestly asking, not trying to troll you, if you are going this route, why not
vegasnative
12/7/19 3:00pm
🤷♂️ You'd have to ask my wife for that. I don't know all the reasons why she went that route. I will say this though:
durandal
12/7/19 3:06pm
That's why my wife did that: she wanted the midwife who'd be there throughout.
Narfin'Coug
12/7/19 4:23pm
Midwives are great and used all over the world. we had a kid at home. No issues.
Iman23
12/7/19 12:03pm
Make sure it’s one who can perform a Csection if needed
I'mBatman
12/7/19 12:03pm
Are there midwifes that can perform C-Sections? I've never heard of that.
vegasnative
12/7/19 3:01pm
I think that’s his point...
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 3:02pm
We've done midwife and OB...
annapcoug
12/7/19 12:03pm
Personal experience: My mom would be dead, twice. My son might would also likely
Powerbait DPM studnt
12/7/19 12:04pm
Are they gonna ride their horse and buggy to get there?
Turnpike Lane
12/7/19 12:07pm
My Sister did this while living in a rural area a couple hours outside St. Louis
carcoug
12/7/19 12:11pm
95% chance nothing goes wrong, but for the 5% doctor/hospital is the only way
mudpupper
12/7/19 12:19pm
My wife is a labor and delivery rn and she tells me...
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 12:23pm
This. Not worth the risk.
Ironhide
12/7/19 12:36pm
Not worth the risk IMO.
spugeddy24
12/7/19 12:35pm
What is more important, your social comfort or 2 lives?
mudpupper
12/7/19 12:36pm
In the year 2019, there is no reason to do something stupid like this.
Game Changer
12/7/19 12:47pm
The data shows better outcomes on average for low risk pregnancies OUTSIDE
jkccoug
12/7/19 12:49pm
Sure. And vaccines cause autism, right? Somebody said so, so it must be true
Game Changer
12/7/19 12:51pm
No, REAL data, such as this article from Scientific American
runnincoug
12/7/19 12:56pm
It seems midwives are trained much better outside the US. Maybe that’s a potential fix.
spugeddy24
12/7/19 1:09pm
So, you missed the mark on a few points:
Game Changer
12/7/19 2:38pm
Umm, regarding #2, did you happen to look at the NY Times article?
Phasor
12/7/19 2:50pm
Right. So what does that tell us about the following scenarios?
Game Changer
12/7/19 3:06pm
First of all, I was just pointing out that your point #2 is directly
Phasor
12/7/19 3:21pm
Seems to be some obvious selection bias here. Basically you are gonna pick out
vegasnative
12/7/19 3:14pm
What data is that?
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 12:53pm
see my post above for some of the data and thoughts why
runnincoug
12/7/19 12:56pm
I just quickly looked at a couple papers on the topic.
SweetBabyG
12/7/19 1:09pm
I’m sure if they know going into the birth that there is a high risk...
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 1:16pm
And I actually don’t have that big an issue with using a midwife...
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 1:23pm
I agree with that. I feel like you are essentially paying the hospital $30,000
SweetBabyG
12/7/19 1:29pm
So the question becomes is the risk worth it.
spugeddy24
12/7/19 1:08pm
My opinion hasn’t changed
5150man
12/7/19 12:50pm
We had all seven with midwives and at home. No issues.
niqmadu
12/7/19 12:51pm
You are playing russian roulette. Odds are you will be fine, but when things go
Backcountry
12/7/19 12:53pm
My wife and 3 of my kids would be dead.
coolblue
12/7/19 12:53pm
We used midwifes, but at the hospital. Such a better experience...
Alister Mackenzie
12/7/19 1:12pm
Yes, the stats show that OBs use more interventions for low-risk births.
Phasor
12/7/19 1:19pm
I’ll tell you why I believe this is false...
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 1:29pm
The stats are what they are. You may not like them, but they are not false.
Phasor
12/7/19 1:39pm
You have actual evidence they’re trying to make a tee time...
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 1:47pm
C'mon man, don't be obtuse.
Phasor
12/7/19 1:59pm
That’s your claim not mine...
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 2:47pm
LOL, SweetBabyG's post proves I'm right
Phasor
12/7/19 2:56pm
How does her making a claim “prove” anything?
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 3:00pm
LMGTFY:
Phasor
12/7/19 3:11pm
I didn’t see those qualifications, I checked the posts, please provide a link
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 3:17pm
Maybe he deleted it for privacy reasons.
Phasor
12/7/19 3:25pm
It doesn’t exist on here...
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 3:26pm
It did. BM him if you want to know.
Phasor
12/7/19 3:40pm
Oh I’m sure he’d post an affirmation of it was true...
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 4:28pm
yeah, sorry I deleted my post
SweetBabyG
12/7/19 4:47pm
Or else you didn’t make a truthful or relevant post...
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 5:05pm
Sure, that is a possibility.
SweetBabyG
12/7/19 5:35pm
It is of course but I would imagine you have some basis for your POV
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 5:46pm
Ok so a blog post lacking in statistics or other accreditation
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 3:19pm
Yep, blog post.
SJS
12/7/19 3:21pm
Not sure how he thinks that provides any evidence of anything.
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 3:27pm
It's a known phemonenon.
Phasor
12/7/19 3:34pm
And here it is from the CDC:
Phasor
12/7/19 3:38pm
Ok, so what?
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 3:43pm
Oy vey
Phasor
12/7/19 3:54pm
Yea, midwives don’t do c-sections.
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 3:57pm
Yes, so the point is that:
Phasor
12/7/19 4:03pm
I’m sure midwives don’t want to hand off their patients to a doctor...
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 4:18pm
So to summarize? Phasor is saying that OB's have a higher c/s rate but midwives self report 5x higher mortality rate?
5150man
12/7/19 5:33pm
I don’t think he admitted that midwives have that 5x higher mortality rate...
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 5:54pm
That's what I'm trying to figure out.
5150man
12/7/19 6:29pm
When you look at stats by time of day, around weekends, and around
SweetBabyG
12/7/19 2:01pm
<< Deleted >>
SweetBabyG
12/7/19 2:10pm
I did just now asked her...
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 2:54pm
And speaking of my “expert wife” ad you called her...
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 2:58pm
I’m a doc (not Obgyn) and I actually do review OB OR schedules
SJS
12/7/19 3:04pm
I agree, and I'm glad most hospitals are practicing appropriately these days.
SweetBabyG
12/7/19 5:03pm
Do you have links to your published work?
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 5:08pm
Yep, I have them.
SweetBabyG
12/7/19 5:31pm
Will you provide them?
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 5:54pm
Nope.
SweetBabyG
12/7/19 6:15pm
Well then it kinda looks like maybe it’s not real.
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 6:25pm
There's a mass of evidence showing a history of unnecessary c section in the US.
SweetBabyG
12/7/19 1:40pm
Is there a mass of evidence showing that it’s resulting in more negative
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 1:48pm
Yes, C-section results in higher maternal deaths.
SweetBabyG
12/7/19 1:57pm
And there are stats for this?
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 2:00pm
Yes.
SweetBabyG
12/7/19 2:11pm
Ok, I’m waiting.
CoachSpeak
12/7/19 2:54pm
And even disregarding mortality, it's a major surgery with a much longer
Phasor
12/7/19 2:07pm
Big study in 2016 showed that nurse midwives had 5x the neonatal fatality rate that docs did
SJS
12/7/19 2:33pm
This is just anti doctor speak. Coming from someone who has regularly been
vegasnative
12/7/19 3:29pm
The legal issues are also a problem, but the CDC stats do show that doctors
Phasor
12/7/19 3:56pm
Here's my issue with midwifes. There is a pattern that I have seen with them.
vegasnative
12/7/19 3:58pm
I could very easily see this being true, unfortunately.
Iman23
12/7/19 4:07pm
None of your business and I think midwives are stupid
HansMoleman
12/7/19 6:00pm
Step daughter needs to start making better decisions. Now is the time.
ClackamasCoug
12/7/19 6:40pm
Our first two were born in hospital, all traditional like. Horrible experiences
ICBlue
12/8/19 1:42am
Pretty scary data here: MUCH higher risk out of hospital.
Yllage Vidiot
12/8/19 11:03pm
Have her watch this video:
Yllage Vidiot
12/8/19 11:03pm
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