It looks like Cal allows the LDS student association

Aug 10, 2018
7:57:11am

coolcats All-American

To officially register as an association.

https://callink.berkeley.edu/organization/ldsstudentassociation

I don’t think there is a similar LGBT organization registered at BYU, but I could be wrong. So on paper Cal would seem to have broader inclusion.

But I think an LDS student openly advocating for the Proclamation on the Family would face more derision in a Cal class, compared to a gay rights advocate in a BYU class.

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coolcats

Previous username: sandhills
Bio page: coolcats
Joined: Aug 25, 2001
Last login: Nov 12, 2020
Total posts: 17,639 (1,169 FO)

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Messages

Author

Time

POLL: Which of these universities is least tolerant of others' beliefs?

chilango

8/10/18 6:47am

unfortunately it is BYU in a landslide

BlueFrog

8/10/18 6:49am

That’s absurd. All have areas that are off limits. BYU just has a

gwalker

8/10/18 7:20am

what beliefs get you kicked out of Berkeley? Which ones at BYU?

BlueFrog

8/10/18 7:23am

Conservatism

pegushin

8/10/18 7:42am

I know several life-long conservatives who went to Berkeley and graduated.

Jurisprudence

8/10/18 8:24am

Likely had to hide it/ be in the closet

pegushin

8/10/18 8:39am

BYU undergrad who went to grad school at Berkeley

thejimmer

8/10/18 9:46am

Wulp, they needed someone to mock and make fun of

Borg

8/10/18 2:39pm

I work with a number of them.

chilango

8/10/18 10:45am

were they the types to keep their heads down and not rock the boat or were they.

icecougar

8/10/18 1:45pm

The question is about beliefs, not activities.

jkccoug

8/10/18 4:36pm

When I graduated, Obama was the commencement speaker. It was right after he had

Extra Biscuits

8/10/18 10:09am

That's ridiculous

chazen

8/10/18 3:46pm

I really take exception with how you ask that. Clearly it’s. BYU because of the way you phrased the question. Yet BYU

SouthernBlueBlood

8/10/18 6:50am

Yet so far, the majority of respondents have not selected BYU. In any case, what

chilango

8/10/18 6:55am

BYU also doesn't bill itself as the center of free speech like Berkley does. Yet

Dynasty1

8/10/18 7:03am

Since Free Speech is not accepted at BYU & everyone dresses, looks, & thinks the

U2wearblue

8/11/18 8:48am

This is such a false narrative. This kinda thinking gets old.

Beetdiggercoug

8/11/18 5:33pm

I think BYU's positions differ more from societal 'norms' than Cal or Stanford

unctoothman

8/10/18 7:03am

No one gets kicked out of Berkeley for their views

AxelDC

8/10/18 7:12am

Point out when a BYU student Got expelled for beliefs alone... that doesn’t

Pretorian

8/10/18 7:30am

Exactly my reasoning.

unctoothman

8/10/18 8:57am

well put, the teacher is intolerant for failing a kid for cheating... perfect.

Pretorian

8/10/18 10:38am

RE: Point out when a BYU student Got expelled for beliefs alone... that

chilango

8/10/18 11:06am

Which of the "September Six" were BYU students when that happened?

CougarThug

8/10/18 12:14pm

Maybe you missed the sentence in my post that says: "Not students, but some of

chilango

8/10/18 12:24pm

Well professors and students are quite different and from what I can see

Pretorian

8/10/18 12:48pm

When discussing intolerance, I'm not sure why students would matter any more

chilango

8/10/18 1:48pm

This discussion boils down to the rights (if any) of private institutions...

Pretorian

8/10/18 2:05pm

I don't disagree with anything you wrote, but the fact that an institution is

chilango

8/10/18 9:57pm

If I change my religious beliefs from anything other than Mormonism I get booted

Jezza

8/10/18 11:53am

This has been hashed out a billion times here. Ecclesiastical endorsements

Jay Rick

8/10/18 5:49pm

It’s been hashed out bc you said so? I disagree. I was there not what I saw

Pretorian

8/10/18 5:52pm

It’s not hashed because I said so. It’s hashed out because it’s bees discussed

Jay Rick

8/10/18 10:19pm

Ok, hashed out..... I have not doubt you're right it's been heavily discussed

Pretorian

8/12/18 6:56pm

No one?

shatter2

8/10/18 9:23am

It is not getting kicked out for your beliefs, it is based upon acting according

BYU I Bleed Blue

8/10/18 9:25am

A Stanford one:

shatter2

8/10/18 9:29am

As public universities, I do not believe Cal and Stanford have the legal right

here's to hoping

8/10/18 9:58am

Stanford is not a public university. It is private, similar to BYU.

Greg Kite's 'stache

8/10/18 10:23am

I stand corrected. Thanks. It doesn't change my point about Cal.

here's to hoping

8/10/18 1:20pm

But what about conservative speakers who are prevented from speaking.

JmThms

8/10/18 11:13am

Link? Unless you're talking about white supremacists?

chilango

8/10/18 11:21am

The problem is that everyone that is against open borders is labeled

Dynasty1

8/10/18 12:08pm

That is a ludicrous claim

Jezza

8/10/18 12:11pm

Not only is it not “ludicrous” it is barely an exaggeration...

CoachSpeak

8/10/18 12:18pm

...

Jezza

8/10/18 12:24pm

Link?

chilango

8/10/18 12:29pm

He would have to provide tons of links to back that up. The fact

Jezza

8/10/18 12:32pm

You really need a link to know that....

CoachSpeak

8/10/18 1:25pm

Your continued evasion tells me you got nothin’. Amiright?

chilango

8/10/18 9:36pm

Nope...

CoachSpeak

8/10/18 10:32pm

You might have noticed that as a non-donor I don’t have access to the political

chilango

8/11/18 5:25am

I'm talking about actual white supremacists, such as Richard Spencer who was

chilango

8/10/18 12:29pm

So it took a lawsuit on his part for them to allow him to speak?

CoachSpeak

8/10/18 1:15pm

Yes, the universities involved (not Cal or Stanford, to my knowledge, but

chilango

8/10/18 9:28pm

Hmmm.......

CoachSpeak

8/10/18 10:33pm

Is Ben Shapiro a white supremacist?

CoachSpeak

8/10/18 12:16pm

I don't know who that is. Are you saying he wanted to speak at Berkeley and they

chilango

8/10/18 12:27pm

You don’t know who Ben Shapiro is??

SactOWNit

8/10/18 12:40pm

I don't think Chilango watches Fox News. Or hangs out with any conservative

JmThms

8/10/18 2:12pm

I don’t watch Fox News either...

CoachSpeak

8/10/18 3:07pm

You don't know who Ben Shapiro is?

CoachSpeak

8/10/18 1:21pm

we all have blind spots, no need to make person attacks, I didn't know stanford

here's to hoping

8/10/18 2:20pm

That’s what I said. I think I vaguely recognize the name, maybe, but have no

chilango

8/10/18 9:33pm

Antifa groups at Berkeley think that physically attacking conservatives is a

AF Cougar

8/10/18 1:09pm

link

here's to hoping

8/10/18 1:55pm

Thanks, this is much more helpful, and accurate, than the nonsense posted above

chilango

8/10/18 9:38pm

No, just publicly ridiculed and ostracized for sharing them honestly.

zonacougar

8/10/18 11:25am

And no one ever gets socially ostracized at BYU for expressing unpopular

Jay Rick

8/10/18 5:51pm

Oh gosh. The ignorance displayed on this board.

chazen

8/10/18 3:51pm

Cal doesn’t have beliefs. Neither does Stanford.

mikecito

8/10/18 7:03am

Yep, difference is that Cal and Stanford may choose not to collaborate

GoodUte

8/10/18 7:13am

False, completely false....

CoachSpeak

8/10/18 9:44am

Read the post again bro

GoodUte

8/10/18 3:09pm

I read it, it’s still false...

CoachSpeak

8/10/18 4:32pm

Your rebuttal was 100% in agreement with what I posted.

GoodUte

8/10/18 10:27pm

You cannot laud UC and Stanford for not discriminating who attends, since they

here's to hoping

8/10/18 10:06am

Wrong. BYU does not “limit attendance based on active sexual orientation!”

Lolo

8/10/18 7:15am

That’s not true

mikecito

8/10/18 7:19am

Fair enough, but abiding by the Law of Chasity, and not permitting attendance

Lolo

8/10/18 7:25am

Which gives me an honest question... why would anyone want to go to or try to go

Pretorian

8/10/18 7:38am

That is a good question

mikecito

8/10/18 7:44am

That is all well and good but if you want BYU, there is an HC

Pretorian

8/10/18 7:49am

This is blatantly false. The HC and church standards explicitly forbid

Jezza

8/10/18 11:55am

What is “non sexual gay activity”?

CoachSpeak

8/11/18 10:48am

Going on a date. Holding hands. Etc.

Jay Rick

8/11/18 10:57am

All are preludes to sex....

CoachSpeak

8/11/18 11:09am

You also wouldn't be able to get an ecclesiastical endorsement if you expressed

Jay Rick

8/10/18 5:55pm

This scenario is stupid... in this case it is extremely likely this person only

Pretorian

8/10/18 9:09pm

Um... disagreeing with the church on a topic doesn’t make a person evil

mikecito

8/10/18 9:17pm

Never did I say that disagreeing with the church makes you evil

Pretorian

8/10/18 9:58pm

Uh…

Jay Rick

8/10/18 10:17pm

ok, ok... it seems clear you and I are hashing out the extremes when there is a

Pretorian

8/12/18 8:05pm

Thumbs up. Totally.

Jay Rick

8/12/18 9:00pm

BYU was the school that didn't allow blacks

AxelDC

8/10/18 7:15am

Wait-timeout here. There was never a “ban on blacks at BYU”

Greg Kite's 'stache

8/10/18 7:40am

I think that is what Axel was referring to but good to clarify.

mikecito

8/10/18 7:44am

Have you ever said anything positive about BYU or the Church?

Carnac

8/10/18 8:02am

That was meant for Axels comment, right?

pegushin

8/10/18 8:07am

Yes. Sorry.

Carnac

8/10/18 8:10am

This is correct. There was never a black ban at BYU. That's an absurd claim.

macdizzle

8/10/18 12:58pm

Because no other schools ever discriminated blacks...

Pretorian

8/10/18 7:46am

mfw BYU 'discriminated' against blacks

Dissenter

8/10/18 8:03am

Excellent troll...but I bet you are intolerant of others.

Beetdiggercoug

8/10/18 9:08am

Not true at all

Chet Donnelly

8/10/18 9:22am

When did BYU not allow blacks?

CoachSpeak

8/10/18 9:48am

Unless you're a Republican, Mormon, and straight. Then they care a lot.

IronPotato

8/10/18 8:55am

BYU has the luxury of requiring limitations on their students because it is a

here's to hoping

8/10/18 10:01am

been said a few times above, but Stanford is a private school.

Jay Rick

8/10/18 5:57pm

The one that doesn’t believe in free speech

kcca

8/10/18 7:50am

It looks like Cal allows the LDS student association

coolcats

8/10/18 7:57am

When I was at BYU there was group for LGB. The president of the group spoke in

BYUtka

8/10/18 8:04am

I have heard one exists

coolcats

8/10/18 8:09am

Well here is some info about it

mikecito

8/10/18 8:18am

I imagine that BYU as a private university is wary of allowing such an

here's to hoping

8/10/18 10:19am

You are wrong about the LGBT at BYU. FWIW.

jkccoug

8/10/18 4:39pm

Having considerable spent time on all 3 campuses

Bucko

8/10/18 8:25am

Yep.

PJMort

8/10/18 9:53am

Of course it includes both religion and LGBT. Along with race, social mores,

chilango

8/10/18 10:50am

My question was more of is LGBT "a belief"?

Bucko

8/10/18 5:18pm

Some believe that same-sex marriage is OK. And some believe that sexual

chilango

8/10/18 10:05pm

Inside the classroom or inside the dorms?

Shore10

8/10/18 9:16pm

This is idiotic

SliqRic

8/10/18 8:26am

It’s California and it’s not close

2FarGone

8/10/18 8:32am

Why isn't Utah on this list? They are the most anti-Mormon university by far

BlooCoog

8/10/18 9:08am

I've been to BYU games against both schools in Provo and at their stadiums as well.

SpiffCoug

8/10/18 9:08am

This is a no win poll.

Refugee

8/10/18 9:20am

Depends on who you ask

Byu_1988

8/10/18 9:25am

Trying to understand what CBers consider to be tolerant or intolerant, given the

chilango

8/10/18 10:52am

It depends on the audience. If we're talking about students, it is BYU.

macdizzle

8/10/18 9:26am

Woah! You think BYU students are more opposed to people's beliefs?!

2FarGone

8/10/18 10:11am

I could be wrong, but I think macdizzle meant intolerance of the university in

here's to hoping

8/10/18 10:25am

Yes this is what I meant

macdizzle

8/10/18 11:03am

Most BYU students are pretty tolerant because they've always been around others

j20

8/10/18 9:53am

No clue. SPORTS: I think Cal was most opposed to BYU joining the PAC the past.

Benfica1

8/10/18 9:56am

Ask yourself this question:

CrimsonCardinal

8/10/18 10:24am

Perfect example

Pretorian

8/10/18 10:46am

I'm guessing the school at which this event was held was not BYU. Has such an

chilango

8/10/18 10:55am

Not BYU. I'd be amazed if there were any problems at BYU for this.

CrimsonCardinal

8/10/18 12:41pm

Unless things have changed significantly since I was there, I would be amazed if

chilango

8/10/18 10:08pm

Meh. Conservative groups set up tables near Sather Gate at Cal every

Josef K

8/10/18 11:25am

They put up with "conservative" in the abstract just fine.

CrimsonCardinal

8/10/18 12:43pm

LOL. Try setting up hollocost is fake table in Brooklyn and see how it goes

Josef K

8/10/18 12:57pm

Well. One of those opinions is at least close to accurate.

boogers

8/10/18 1:03pm

You think "abortion is murder" is an intolerant statement? And your comparison

here's to hoping

8/10/18 2:10pm

No, it’s not objectively true. The church does consider it murder, the law

Josef K

8/10/18 2:33pm

Abortion is murder... PERIOD

bluecougar1985

8/11/18 8:06am

If it’s murder, why is it okay if I’m raped?

Jay Rick

8/11/18 11:02am

That actually isn’t what it says...

CoachSpeak

8/11/18 11:13am

That actually almost exactly what the handbook says.

Jay Rick

8/11/18 3:33pm

No. It’s not.

Josef K

8/12/18 1:00am

Nope...

CoachSpeak

8/10/18 3:12pm

Regarding Cal, it depends whether you are referring to the administration, the

Josef K

8/10/18 11:29am

I think this is probably a pretty accurate view.

chilango

8/10/18 12:33pm

Very well put. And really gets at the point. People always point out that there

Jay Rick

8/10/18 10:29pm

LOL. The result of this poll is pathetic 😂

Jezza

8/10/18 11:49am

Umm al-Qura University probably wins hands down

CougarThug

8/10/18 12:04pm

Define Intolerance....Does publicly mocking another group represent intolerance?

OBXCougar

8/10/18 2:19pm

I think it can include all of those things. However, not every type of

chilango

8/10/18 10:21pm

That’s being a bit naive isn’t it?

StalwartBraveTrue

8/10/18 11:56pm

So in your opinion, which elementary school is more intolerant: the one that

chilango

8/11/18 5:16am

You are missing the point.

StalwartBraveTrue

8/11/18 7:47am

I'm not missing that point. I just disagree with you. Both are repulsive, for

chilango

8/11/18 8:00am

I guess I’m missing your point...which is?

StalwartBraveTrue

8/11/18 9:52am

I would phrase it differently: some types of intolerance are more destructive

chilango

8/11/18 10:47am

Certainly. But is the point of the poll to establish

StalwartBraveTrue

8/11/18 11:34am

Actually, it was to understand how CBers perceive intolerance on a relative

chilango

8/11/18 4:53pm

The ones that have violent riots when a speaker comes to campus and whose bands

Abe Froman

8/10/18 2:22pm

Two cents

Srg

8/10/18 3:38pm

Most Berkeley students are very nice

CougarWildcat

8/10/18 4:13pm

Are you talking about views of those in other campuses or

Stalwart Man

8/10/18 6:11pm

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