It was painful listening and arguing with many on CB who wanted

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Aug 4, 2019
10:40:01pm

rainorsnow All-American

It was painful listening and arguing with many on CB who wanted

to stay Indy and not jump to the Big 12. They, like BYU, were not thinking clearly. Sad sad deal.

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rainorsnow

Bio page: rainorsnow
Joined: Aug 22, 2010
Last login: May 7, 2024
Total posts: 19,097 (630 FO)

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Messages

Author

Time

Absolute implosion of BYU sports the last few yrs under Holmoe is unforgivable

snowbird

8/4/19 3:34pm

Isn't the consesus he is a yes man so the BoT likes him?

TNT

8/4/19 3:35pm

It’s not a consensus. It’s reality.

8/4/19 5:47pm

This was the moment that I realized Holmoe could no longer be trusted with BYU sports.

Pimpin4Paradise

8/4/19 3:39pm

Holy crap. I laughed hard

Stucoug83

8/4/19 9:24pm

Here’s the problem with that...

CoachSpeak

8/4/19 3:39pm

This is good

Prickly Heat

8/4/19 4:23pm

I think this is the key.

HomeTownHero

8/4/19 5:48pm

Personally I don’t think holmoe has anything to do with

cougfanz

8/4/19 5:51pm

If he gets blamed for failures of football and basketball then he gets credit...

icecougar

8/5/19 2:00am

amen

8/5/19 12:11pm

Those sports don’t bring money or prestige to BYU so who cares if they are good

Dillinger

8/4/19 8:42pm

So why have them then? I’ll tell you why...

icecougar

8/5/19 2:39am

PAC 10 is called conference of champions because they gave themselves a nickname

ochobeeguy

8/5/19 9:37am

That is correct. Outside of the PAC most people don't call them that

pappabear246

8/6/19 5:31am

This is the longest period of time since early 70’s that we have gone without a

Oranje

8/4/19 6:23pm

The problem with your take is sports aren't even close to what they were pre-90s

palangi

8/4/19 10:26pm

Problem with your post is that most of the championships took place post 1990.

Oranje

8/4/19 11:05pm

<< Deleted >>

Oranje

8/4/19 10:52pm

Directors Cup standings are much lower than where they’ve been historically.

NorCal_Coug

8/4/19 6:34pm

But does that tell the whole story?

HomeTownHero

8/4/19 7:43pm

It’s overlooking what football and basketball have done

puntersarepeople

8/4/19 7:47pm

<< Deleted >>

fenderbender

8/4/19 8:18pm

In the 8 years before Holmoe, BYU won 7 national championships. Since then, ZERO

Oranje

8/4/19 10:04pm

Surprising that volleyball hasnt

puntersarepeople

8/4/19 10:14pm

Unfortunately Our current coaches aren’t what McGown and Peterson were.

Oranje

8/4/19 11:09pm

Ha ha. Are you Larry Scott?

BrobaFett

8/4/19 7:12pm

Is Larry Scott on cougar board?

Jazznut26

8/4/19 10:04pm

Even if that was true, those other sports dont pay the bills

Iki_Balam

8/4/19 10:14pm

That's more a product of the recruiting pipeline than it is the AD

Medute

8/5/19 10:02am

If they want to "give that up to play for a national power"...

CoachSpeak

8/5/19 10:22am

Better NFL talent production, coaching, and playing in PAC12

Medute

8/5/19 12:53pm

That's fine but you said they want to play for a "national power"...

CoachSpeak

8/6/19 12:39pm

Yeah, I think I was just referring to the top LDS athletes

Medute

8/6/19 1:13pm

Got it...

CoachSpeak

8/6/19 1:18pm

Yeah, I don't ever see Utah becoming one of the "sexy" schools

Medute

8/6/19 1:26pm

And that is the problem. Those "other" sports don't drive the revenue...

8/5/19 10:45am

I don't care how good USU becomes with Anderson. BYU should be winning that game

Preppy

8/4/19 3:40pm

He was a good coach at Cal though

Mr. Belding

8/4/19 3:41pm

This is cute

Prickly Heat

8/4/19 4:25pm

Before or after he destroyed their program?

8/4/19 9:08pm

So who should he have hired for football instead?

mudpupper

8/4/19 3:42pm

Lance Anderson

vagabonder

8/4/19 5:10pm

Really, it's hard to imagine a better set of experiences for a future BYU HC.

8/4/19 9:09pm

Ken Niumatalolo

reddead

8/5/19 8:43am

You guys were losing your minds about Ken N running the option.

8/5/19 10:19am

My HS team ran the option, so I was all about Ken N. But you're right, option

reddead

8/5/19 3:36pm

This isn’t entirely correct, there’s a little bit of truth in it...

CoachSpeak

8/6/19 8:30pm

I don’t like to be teased

8/6/19 10:00pm

I know, that’s super lame of me...

CoachSpeak

8/6/19 10:05pm

I remember reading a newspaper that interviewed him about the job and then watched him I think

8/6/19 10:14pm

You're definition of implosion is interesting. Need to look at your facts in

basman

8/4/19 3:51pm

weak

4mack

8/4/19 3:53pm

I thought of this too

TADOW

8/4/19 3:56pm

Starting to fall behind/letting Utah State catch up should be concerning to every BYU fan

Bonoman

8/4/19 4:02pm

I suppose LaVell should have had that attitude.

Y05

8/4/19 4:22pm

This is well crafted

Prickly Heat

8/4/19 4:28pm

I am not convinced there is the commitment needed to elevate each program back what you mentioned....

Bonoman

8/4/19 4:00pm

What is it you think they’re trying to do?

Pretorian

8/4/19 7:29pm

Sounds kind of like his coaching career...

Real Men Wear Blue

8/4/19 4:05pm

The Holmoe period has been a complete disaster. A massive failure.

Backcountry

8/4/19 4:07pm

3 straight losing seasons, sexual misconduct scandals

8/4/19 4:12pm

Preach.

8/4/19 4:22pm

A truth or two but just as many or more falsehoods

coug10278

8/4/19 4:19pm

Your confusing "athletic department" with "football team"

MaxxPower

8/4/19 6:22pm

Football matters most. However,

8/4/19 7:22pm

Football and mens basketball are the only relevant pieces

Backcountry

8/5/19 1:48pm

So is the argument that it's Holmoe's fault is he should have done what?

whiteninja

8/4/19 4:09pm

He failed to hire KWhitt. As much as I dislike him, and as “good” as Bronco was,

rainorsnow

8/4/19 4:16pm

It was solely on Kwhitt that he didn’t come. His players wanted him to stay so he stayed.

8/4/19 4:20pm

💰 💰 💰

rainorsnow

8/4/19 4:26pm

Wrong

TNT

8/4/19 4:28pm

What is right then?

8/4/19 4:30pm

Utah came up with more money on their counter offer

TNT

8/4/19 4:32pm

I thought players showed up to his house and asked him to stay.... that’s what several people on here have said.

8/4/19 4:36pm

They did. But that wasn't the deciding factor

TNT

8/4/19 4:38pm

Ok. You win TNT.

8/4/19 4:53pm

Wahoo! TNT = 567. CB = 45,412

TNT

8/4/19 5:04pm

You got sources saying it was him and not the BOT or attorneys?

BYUfan92

8/4/19 4:20pm

That's fair

TNT

8/4/19 4:22pm

It’s his job to sell it to them.

rainorsnow

8/4/19 4:26pm

No, his job is to implement what the BOT wants

BYUfan92

8/4/19 4:56pm

That's sad if the BOT can't let someone do their job.

rainorsnow

8/4/19 4:57pm

Yup

ZooBlue

8/4/19 5:38pm

Yeah, Whitt had nothing to do with the decision. We could’ve just made him come!

canofpicante

8/5/19 8:37am

I feel the last AD with a strong vision of what he wanted to accomplish was Rondo Fehlberg...he got shown the door

Bonoman

8/4/19 8:06pm

RE: I feel the last AD with a strong vision of what he wanted to accomplish was

Prickly Heat

8/4/19 10:05pm

Who was the dumpster fire that he hired? Please elaborate.

Oranje

8/5/19 11:21am

Whitt has nothing to do with the decision?

canofpicante

8/5/19 8:36am

Haha. The PAC-12 didn’t even exist back when Bronco was hired at BYU. These

rainorsnow

8/5/19 8:48am

Haha. It depends which time you’re talking about 🙄

canofpicante

8/5/19 8:58am

What other time would I be talking about??

rainorsnow

8/5/19 9:06am

The time Bronco left, duh. We talked to Whitt then too.

canofpicante

8/5/19 12:00pm

Yeah, Holmoe talked with him at the airport about Kalani. KW was never an option

rainorsnow

8/5/19 1:13pm

He was never an option the first time either.

canofpicante

8/6/19 11:31am

Wow. You’re the first person I’ve heard say KW was not an option

rainorsnow

8/6/19 11:35am

Hindsight is a wonderful thing and there is absolutely no way to know that

ManicBlue

8/5/19 9:18am

Well, he was BYU's #1 target for a reason. Not only that, he was the HC at

rainorsnow

8/5/19 10:34am

Agreed! BYU should have made KW a offer BEFORE Sanford took the job at UNLV...

8/5/19 10:23am

THe pitch to the Big12 in 2011 was bad

I'mBatman

8/4/19 5:10pm

So presumptuous. Please enlighten us as to our exact demands. I eagerly await...

canofpicante

8/5/19 8:39am

It was more than just no-Sunday play, which was too much. Here's Harmon's take:

rainorsnow

8/5/19 9:05am

This is nothing more than Harmon’s opinion and he says as much in the article.

canofpicante

8/5/19 12:13pm

We know BYU tried to negotiate on more than just no-Sunday play. That

rainorsnow

8/5/19 1:40pm

How do “we know”? We don’t.

canofpicante

8/6/19 12:12pm

I love Holmoe. I support his AD a ton. I want him to be the best AD in the

rainorsnow

8/6/19 7:53pm

You’ve shown us the symptoms. What’s the cause? What specifically has he done or not done that implies he’s the source?

Refugee

8/4/19 4:18pm

The facts are the facts. The failures have been while he was in charge.

8/4/19 6:51pm

A few:

chazen

8/4/19 9:12pm

Add to that he forces in Detmer, who also had no coaching experience in college

Iki_Balam

8/4/19 10:15pm

RE: A few:

Refugee

8/4/19 10:22pm

I doubt Sitake caused the collapse of BYU basketball. I could be wrong

canofpicante

8/5/19 8:41am

I really don’t care much about basketball

chazen

8/14/19 11:12am

I don't pin Independence on him. That is the driving force.

CougarinOZ

8/4/19 4:21pm

He took BYU independent, but you don’t pin that on him?

rainorsnow

8/4/19 4:38pm

Waayyy too simplistic. Unlike every other college

FanofBYU

8/4/19 6:41pm

Sinking ship or not the Big 12 was our only viable option then, as it is still

Jacksonian76

8/4/19 10:33pm

It was painful listening and arguing with many on CB who wanted

rainorsnow

8/4/19 10:40pm

Are you referring to 2011 or 2016?

Refugee

8/4/19 10:45pm

2011

rainorsnow

8/4/19 11:08pm

I agree that the Big12 would have been ideal

FanofBYU

8/4/19 11:44pm

Name the others then. Everyone claims Holmoe doesn't have to do anything as AD.

rainorsnow

8/5/19 12:12am

You can't be serious. Chris Hill had full authority. Also, the UofU President

FanofBYU

8/5/19 8:38am

So, you’re fine with BYU lying to the fan base in saying that they’re

rainorsnow

8/5/19 8:44am

Lying? Just because BYU BOT expect certain things doesn't mean they aren't

FanofBYU

8/5/19 9:53am

Lying. Misleading. Bending the truth. Whatever you want to call it. Their

rainorsnow

8/5/19 10:10am

What we’re saying is the BOT is not as

FanofBYU

8/5/19 11:04am

And I agree.

rainorsnow

8/5/19 11:13am

Doesn’t mean BYU isn’t trying to

FanofBYU

8/5/19 12:39pm

Holmoe has worked miracles given his circumstances. You're wrong if you think we can do better.

HarlemCoug

8/4/19 4:28pm

My only beef with him is nudging Detmer into the OC spot

BlackBart

8/4/19 4:32pm

BYU has a successful business program, but there’s no one that is

rainorsnow

8/4/19 4:41pm

Sincere question: how many schools have a business guy as AD?

Y05

8/4/19 4:49pm

Many do have a sports background, naturally. Small sample of CFB playoff ADs:

rainorsnow

8/4/19 5:08pm

Many of whom you touch on have deep, expansive relationships

BlackBart

8/4/19 8:59pm

Seems like a safe bet. Lewis will likely do anything the BOT says.

rainorsnow

8/4/19 9:10pm

This is the correct response. Everything else in my limited view

TempeCoug

8/4/19 6:36pm

It’s a tough position to define success and it’s a tough position to know whethe

cougfanz

8/4/19 4:41pm

This is true. Not unique to BYU

TNT

8/4/19 4:44pm

The positives of the athletic program heavily outweigh the negative.

troymac32

8/4/19 4:53pm

Most of the factors driving those things are not AD controlled

8/4/19 5:03pm

Blame it on the BOT

maxpowers

8/4/19 5:04pm

No, it’s not

puntersarepeople

8/4/19 5:06pm

Thankfully Tom has a plan.

Zach Morris

8/4/19 5:09pm

Good grief.

Mark

8/4/19 5:10pm

Just a WEE BIT of over-exaggeration there, or might we say an

BYU I Bleed Blue

8/4/19 10:15pm

Amen!!

8/4/19 11:26pm

I also keep hearing about how awful our swimming pool is

D.T. Survivor

8/4/19 5:14pm

“It’s not his fault” - Sincerely, Every blind follower of every bad leader.

8/4/19 5:17pm

Anywhere else and he'd have been fired long ago.

rainorsnow

8/4/19 5:19pm

Sad sad truth. And I’ve been told by people that he knows it too.

8/4/19 5:48pm

RE: Absolute implosion of BYU sports the last few yrs under Holmoe is

MormonThug

8/4/19 5:28pm

Bookmarked

8/4/19 5:47pm

Yeah, there’s a lot that’s wrong, but thinking an AD swap would fix it is silly

cajuncoug

8/4/19 5:49pm

Who would’ve handled things better?

Aircooled

8/4/19 5:53pm

How could anyone possibly know that? Why or how can anyone just assume that

8/4/19 7:00pm

You're right...we don't know that.

Aircooled

8/5/19 12:09pm

I’ve been critical of Holmoe and some of his hires, but I’m not sure BYU

ataylor

8/4/19 5:55pm

This modern hyperbole exaggerating mentality where everything is “literally” the

Pretorian

8/4/19 6:03pm

"implosion." You like using hyperbole

Adrielle

8/4/19 6:15pm

An athletic director should be graded on Leerfield cup standings with added weight to football and basketball

MaxxPower

8/4/19 6:16pm

I think we need to see how Pope does and how he handles the football situation

pappabear246

8/4/19 7:03pm

Implosion? What an over exaggeration!!! Someone needs a hug today!!

Chuckie2304

8/4/19 7:22pm

It's far from an "absolute implosion."

lightmann

8/4/19 7:23pm

There is a thin line between winning in college athletics. We are so spoiled

MajorZeus

8/4/19 7:27pm

Be sure to get these shots in before both sports start making significant

tony

8/4/19 8:12pm

So many of the points you rightfully make correlate with independence though...

fenderbender

8/4/19 8:21pm

Worst decision (for TH, BYU, and the BOT) at the time. I wish I could go back

rainorsnow

8/4/19 8:27pm

Funny how you think BYU will do something it nor any other school has done

Iki_Balam

8/4/19 10:18pm

The measure of success for an AD is much broader than on-field success for just men's football & basketball

cougXor

8/4/19 8:59pm

Your thinking is very shallow...Holmoe is not the root cause of any “implosion”

fatkid

8/4/19 9:40pm

BYU athletics died under Holmoe. The cause of death was Utah to the PAC 12

Blue2thebone

8/4/19 10:16pm

Nope. BYU athletics is alive and still going, just on the rebound!

BYU I Bleed Blue

8/4/19 10:20pm

The night is darkest before the dawn

fatkid

8/5/19 6:46am

RE: BYU athletics died under Holmoe. The cause of death was Utah to the PAC 12

puntersarepeople

8/4/19 10:26pm

Really? I have never been more excited about the future of BYU football.

Refugee

8/4/19 10:38pm

Really? Never been more excited? About what?

Blue2thebone

8/4/19 11:22pm

These things cycle. It’s not always gonna be this way. This is not all on Holmoe or any one thing.

Refugee

8/5/19 5:09am

Such as?

Backcountry

8/5/19 12:13pm

Read my post just above.

Refugee

8/5/19 12:31pm

You obviously didn't follow BYU football in the 80's and 90's.

BleedCougarBlue2

8/5/19 1:02pm

I certainly did. I remember the miracle bowl to this day and everything good and bad after. Been a diehard fan since.

Refugee

8/5/19 1:24pm

Died? A bit melodramatic. Was it a setback? Absolutely. If memory

FanofBYU

8/5/19 8:30am

Do we have a pulse or are we dead? Choose one. 🙄

canofpicante

8/5/19 8:33am

RE: BYU athletics died under Holmoe. The cause of death was Utah to the PAC 12

tony

8/5/19 2:31pm

Give it a rest. Dude was a genius when we were winning...

canofpicante

8/4/19 11:03pm

It’s been almost a DECADE since then. Wake. The. Yewt. Up.

8/4/19 11:17pm

"He didn't change. What did then?" Everything changed since then. Right after

rainorsnow

8/5/19 12:03am

You think staying Indy was Holmoe’s decision?! 😂🤪🙄

canofpicante

8/5/19 8:21am

And you think BYU would be winning like BSU if it were in the MWC. Have you not

rainorsnow

8/5/19 9:16am

It’s insane that all those things are facts. They are reality. And yet so many

8/6/19 1:37am

RE: Absolute implosion of BYU sports the last few yrs under Holmoe is

8/4/19 11:17pm

RE: Absolute implosion of BYU sports the last few yrs under Holmoe is

Prickly Heat

8/5/19 7:16am

He was the AD that finally got rid of the Cattermole's and got a real coach for

ManicBlue

8/5/19 9:06am

We are talking about Gymnastics? Not sure many care!

dodgersjazzcougs

8/5/19 9:17am

I never thought much of it, but that guy was pretty odd.

8/5/19 9:19am

Um, he had been AD for at least 10 years by the time the Cattermoles left...

Oranje

8/5/19 11:18am

Also the longest stretch without a national championship in any sport since

8/5/19 9:19am

?? Compared to who? And for what sports?

Jasbo

8/5/19 3:54pm

How about Men's Volleyball Nat'l Championships in 1999, 2001, 2004?

Jasbo

8/5/19 3:55pm

15 years since last national championship. That's the longest drought in decades

8/5/19 4:56pm

I'd like to defend Holmoe and counter you but your facts are solid ):

stealth

8/5/19 10:00am

Holmoe has been a positive influence. Heres why

baldcoug74

8/5/19 10:19am

Oh the the olympic sports argument. Truth is they are down from where they were.

Oranje

8/5/19 10:35am

Yep

8/5/19 11:01am

RE: Oh the the olympic sports argument. Truth is they are down from where they

Fansince67

8/5/19 11:33am

With the exception of women’s rugby we did that and better before Holmoe.

Oranje

8/5/19 5:05pm

”Club sport” ❓

MichCoug

8/7/19 5:24pm

You are being selective ... both volleyball teams have been to final 4/

8/7/19 5:58pm

Wow. Maybe a little hyperbole here?!!

Jasbo

8/5/19 3:52pm

Is this a joke?? "Absolute Implosion?" Thank you for the good laugh on a Monday!

8/5/19 5:28pm

My Xbox 360 broke

8/5/19 5:39pm

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