I've had it explained to me a number of ways, and your explanation is equally unsatisfying. It's not apostasy or anything sinful, but it still bugs me. More than yBU? or whatever other garbage I remember from Logan.

If I were to run around in front of every new meetinghouse construction, or temple construction and say things like "Do Brigham City and South Utah County really need a temple?" I think that people would look at me a little funny. That's how "waste of tithing" resonates with me. Not as a sin or anything but as a little off.

By the same token, I think ALUFs and ALUSUFs and other AL--Fs focus on how BYU students have a sense of superiority, and whatever. Most BYU fans don't mean to be that way--even if it comes across to some that way. So I guess my point is maybe perception is different than reality--on both sides. I perceive "waste of tithing" to be a bigger deal than it probably is, and you perceive self-righteous superiority complex to be more widespread than it really is.

I can understand your point, though. I can see getting really upset when people say you must support this or that (non-doctrinal matter) to be a good LDS member. My blood boils everytime Harry Reid suggests that if I really thought about my faith I would have the same political leaning that he does.

I went to BYU undergrad, lived in/around Logan for quite a while, and am at Utah for grad school. I found that the ALUSUFs were the most rabid and disrespectful when they found out I was a BYU alum. It was surprising that the most "righteous" kids in the ward were always the most rabid when BYU came up. Some people were so disrespectful on this point that I actually couldn't deal with them without constant BYU cracks. (I'm not talking good-natured sports jawing, it always had to do with how they thought that BYU shouldn't exist.) The ALUFs I know are somewhat similar in this regard though most are a little tamer--it's always the most faithful members who have the greatest hatred for BYU.

I don't understand this and I probably never will. I do, however, think there are a few things that we (as BYU fans) can do to limit the amount of hatred that ALUFs/ALUSUFs have for BYU fans.

1. Knock it off with the Harvard of the West crap. It's a good school, but it's not even USC, UCLA or Wash U in St. Louis academically. Granted our accounting is pretty awesome, but we don't have a huge pile of uber-awesome programs like Harvard.

2. Don't say that people only hate BYU because they couldn't get in. 1)Even if it's true, it's offensive. 2)A lot of these kids just want to live at home and BYU is too far away. 3)They were probably raised to hate BYU long before they ever applied. (I'm convinced that even if I had gone to one of the local schools (USU stiffed me on a scholly or else I probably would have gone) I would have still rooted for BYU over my alma mater. BYU sports were a big deal in my home.

3. Don't suggest that just because they go to X school they are drunkards. I have a lot of respect for Utah undergrads who can survive 4 years here and are able to remain active. The U has a good number of LDS kids, but it's also a festering hive of anti-Mormonism. I honestly respect a lot of these kids for keeping their faith intact against that torrent of anti-Mormonism. This also applies to a much lesser extent to USU/UVU/Weber.

4. Move out of the state, if possible. Enter to learn go forth to serve. I'm pretty sure that means enter to learn, then get your tail out of Utah and do some good in the world. You'll meet a lot fewer U/USU/UVU grads outside the state. They were raised there and that's home--I don't blame them--that's where the fam lives, but you won't have to worry about this issue to a great extent outside of the state. (I personally believe Mormons do a lot better NOT surrounded by other Mormons, but that's another topic for another day.)

Suggestions to State school students when dealing with BYU students.

1. Tell me how repressed I was by the honor code and how you're so righteous you don't need an honor code. Tell me how my faith has never been tested. I love that.

2. Talk to me about how I must be super narrow-minded following my education at BYU. Tell me how there is zero diversity of viewpoint among professors and that you're better prepared to deal with the world. (In truth, there's some truth to this, but my take is that BYU gives you a pretty balanced viewpoint--I had conservative and liberal professors. A lot of the other schools will only provide you with the liberal viewpoint.) Ironically, a lot of my BYU cohorts came out a lot more liberal at graduation than I have observed among the state school LDS population.

3. Make Utah County jokes all the time. Try to use Zion Curtain with reference to UtCo. as many times as possible. Tell me how much more well-rounded you are for living in Salt Lake (if anyone tries to make this argument for Logan, I'm sorry, I just laugh.) I love that. Salt Lake is definitely different than Provo, but anything good you can find in Provo you can find in SLC, and vice versa.

4. Tell me how self-righteous and smug I am. Then when you actually get to know me and realize I'm not a degenerate zombie tell me how it's the "other" "bad" BYU people that are the smug self-righteous ones. Comments like these help me to know that you're not judgmental at all.

If all you're going to do is point out "well I heard poster X on CB make this generalization about Ute fans the other day" so you're a hypocrite, you can save it. If trying but often failing to live up to your standards is the definition of hypocrisy, the call me a hypocrite. I'm not perfect by any stretch.